November 4, 1954

Dr. P. R. Edwards
Box 185
Chamblee, Ga.

Dear Phil:

i am sorry If I have seemed uncommunicative about lw or anything else. The
matter had just slipped my mind, and I was preoccupied with other matters. The
main reason, perhaps, is that the results on lw seem ao clear cut that there
scareely needed to be any further debate.

I don't underatand what Ole (Maalge) is driving at; he has expressed his
idea in a very mrky way. At any rate, I can get nothing out of his suggestion
that would be consistent with what we already know of the tramsduction homologies
of the two pd/dd phases and of lw stocks in particular.

Dr. Bernstein's experiments on lw were confined to those represented in the
cultures we sent you some time ago, namely transductioms to S. wien and S.
dar-es-salaam. Since the b phase of S. wien was substituted in S¥-1103 and
SW=1105, these were not particularly informative at that, although the results
were consistent with the formulation S. wien = Hy Hol", SW-l104 was slightly

more informative, as the replacexent of lw of dar-es-salaam by a of sendai

=-yilwy en
suggested that these were homologous, and Imneiscioexdy d.-e.-s. Hy H, .
Your own results are aore instructdve, particularly the transductions from
lw:enx or lwtl,.. stocks to more typical diphasics, which resulted in the

substitution of lw for its homolgue in the recipient, On this basis, fayed is

clearly Hy, Wi.e, as is #408; while worthington is a

To be able to prove this in the most unequivocal fashion, it would be desirable
to compare the transductions from one are stock and a second H,1* stock
t© a common recipient with characteristic H, and H, factors. If wehad a suitable

phage for #408 or dar-es-salaam and for wien, we could do this 41n group B, for
example —x typhimurium. But the presently avatilable data hardly admit of any
other interpretation, provide one can rely on the regularity with which some
iw donors will substitute this factor for a reliable phase-1 of the recipient,
while others will substitdte it for a reliable phase-2. This would mean, at
the very least, to complete the picture ‘that experiments similar to those in
the table you sent me should be repeated mmmaxt several times. I do not think
more extendite experiments are needed, but some of them (e.g. meleagridis —x
bolton, and fayed—-x newport} should be repeated intensively, often enough to
be sure that there is a real, consistent imax differenced in the substitution
hdémology of the two lw phases.
I don't know what the context of your correspondence with Ole was, so
this makes further comment rather difficult. Possibly his remarks are another
way of formulating the idea of two loci, H, and H. He is right that one
could not argue from the naturat distributton of 2 iw as two whether there
was more than one kind of determinant (the odd a:e diphasias point that up!).
But the transduction experiments seem to show quite clearly that there are
two kinds of lw phases, homologous with other phl and ph2 respectively, regardless
of their (accidental ?) serological identity. It would be rather as if the antigens
h, ny x ete. were non-antigenic or not antigenically distinguishable in the

rabbit, so that Heh would be identified with H,° This suggests that it might

in fact be worthwhile to try to analyse H, 7” and a in more detail, to determine

whether there are som subtler serolo;ical differences. But there do not have to
be any. The important thing for the success of this genetic theory is that ,trans—
ductions from a given donor give an unambiguous result as to the homologies.’of

its lw phase. \repeated

Ig J hadn't before, let me thank you now for the cultures, phages, and serum,
I don't think we'll jump in, just yet, into transductions involving other
serological groups, at least until this IV XII-- IV V XII business is cleared
up. Right now, it is very mich up in the air. Until we get some more meaty
results here, I don't know how I could interpret your san diego changes.

I have not seen any Iseki reprints intended for you, as far as I know.
I am sure he would send you a set on request. (His address is Dept. Legal
Medicine, School ofvMedicins, Gunma Universi ty, Maebashi, Japan). I underatand
Lou Baron (in Landy's group at Wash.) has been working on this story too and
has essentially confirmed it. (That is, on the 3,10—3,15 business). As far as
I can tell, Iseki's transduction was with biochamical markers, and involved
the same phage he used for the much more regular conversion of somatic antigens.

I wish we had an opportunity to talk all these things over personally; it
is rather hard to gst everything down on paper. Any chance of your coming out

this way? If you could, I'd like fou to see the Mating of Coli under the micro-
scope, which is what has been keeping me (very) busy lately.

Yours as ever,

Joshua Lederberg
lysogenic Strain

Doner

Result

 

 

S. typhi murium 52 455
& typhi surium fF 436

3, newport 9-54
&. newpert 9-54

S. werthington
S. werthington
&, worthington

5. meleagridis

2961-82
3411-61
3411-81

3E14-52

5. meleagridis 3314-62

3, meleagridis $314-52

S. derby

88-54

S$. jerusalem 258 6,7: L,W819

S. typhi murium Lf-2" 4,5,12: 4-1,2

S. typhi moriwm LY-2'

5.
5.

at
we

be
Se
Be
Se

8.

yea fale

6,8: l,w-l,2

wrthingtos 4586-51 1,13,23: 1,w-r
worthington 4366-81 1,13,23: 1l,wes

worthington 4386-51 1,13,23: 1,w-s

moleagridis 2997-52

balten #S$02

boitan

e408

Se

Se

oslo 1964-49

saleradea 246

3,10: «,h-l,w

3, 10: ¥re,N, 715

4,12: lw: @,n,2

6,7: a-@e,5,z

keeipient
S. dar-es-salaam #72 1,9,12:
S. wien $281 4,12:
S. narashino $55 6,8:
S&S. mewpert 169-54 6,8:
&. tel~el-kebir 13,23:
8. tel~el-kebdir 18,23:
S,. atlanta 13,23:
S. dbelten #302 3,10:
3,10: yoo,n,8)¢ S. melaegridis 2997-52 5,10:
S. elerkenwell #406 $,10:
S. kisangi 4235 4,5,12:
5. solerade 246 6,7:
3. osle 1964 6,7:

6,7: 1,we-l,8

1,4-0,0,3)%
bd-1 Ww

a-@,2,x
o,nel,2

d-e,0,858
d-@ 2.815
d-0, 8,8) 6

YrO Moly
e,h-l w
1,wes
a-1,2

1,w1 8

a-@ 2X

1,9,12:
4,12:

6,8:
6,8:
13,23:
13,23:
13,23:

3,10:

3,10:
$,190:
3,10:
4,5,12:

6,7:
6,7:

6,7:

i~e, 8
d-] w

1,w-08,n,x
1,w-1,2

3-0,5, ®15

d=] aw
%

e, hee, 8,235

yol ,w

@,h: O,Ds815
y-lw
l,wel,2

a-l a &
1,we-e,,%

a-} 6